Are Atik cameras of a good quality?

[choochoo_baloo]

Hello all,

I am interested in the Atik range for my first CCD camera.  How do you rate their products? Specifically I am interested in the 320E and Titan Mono. Obviously being my first 'outlay' with astronimcal products, I am more inclined towards the Titan Mono with it's lower price. It's high fps mode for planetary, and also it's cooled long exposure mode for deep sky work seems an excellent novice hybrid. I realise a 'jack of all trades' will never compete with 2 specialised ones, but thought this would provide a high quality foundation? Any comments or insights would be appreciated.

Thanks

[Helen]

Atik products are excellent. I've owned 4 of their cameras and only had one problem, and that was dealt with by Atik without any fuss and within a fews days. The Titan is a versatile starting camera and would double as a guide camera if you wanted to upgrade later.

Helen

[ronin]

Could you not enquire at the IoA if they have an imaging camera that you could use?

Would save you some cash, at least for a while.

[Earl]

They do good cameras but you dont mention what you intend to use it on or how, these can change things a bit.

[choochoo_baloo]

Thanks for the replies all.

Well I intend to get properly stuck into planetary, and deep sky. Obviously being inexperienced, I don't yet know which (if either) will become by preference in time. Hence why I am drawn to the Atik Titan. Do you agree with my reasoning?

Thank you.

[ollypenrice]

I'm a professional astrophotgraphy provider running four mounts and, currently, four Atik cameras in commercial use. I'm not lookng to change camera supplier. Far from it. I don't know of any other make matching them on reliability, customer service and performance per buck. If I really felt I could get better images elsewhere I would be obliged to do so, but I feel no such obligation. Call me a fan. There are some very bad cameras out there but Atik don't sell them.

Olly

http://ollypenrice.smugmug.com/Other/Best-of-Les-Granges/22435624_WLMPTM#!i=2266922474&k=Sc3kgzc

[Zakalwe]

Atik cameras are very good, but the Titan is a poor compromise. Like any compromises it tends to be the worst of both worlds instead of the best.

The 16-bit dynamic range isn't needed for planetary work and the max speed of 15FPS is very, very slow. There's far cheaper cameras capable of far better planetary results.

Planetary imaging and DSO imaging require almost exactly the opposite needs from a camera. Planetary needs high-speed recording, DSO needs long-exposures, high dynamic ranges with low noise.

[choochoo_baloo]

OK yes you're right Zakalwe, so what is the 'best' solid introduction-type Atik mono CCD model; firstlightoptics sell the 320E for around £800? I really don't want to spend over about £800. For planetary work I don't know of any good quality models with the high fps as you said? Any help from anyone appreciated.

[johnrt]

I would look out for a used Atik 314l+ they seem to be cropping up regularly in the £650-£750 price bracket. Cracking little cameras.

[brantuk]

Have a look at the DMK range of cameras from Imaging Source and also the Celestron Skyris range. They are high frame rate planetary cameras.

For dso's I agree with John - you can get a good Atik 314L+ for around £700 second hand or £1100 brand new. Hth

(I got a 314L+ myself only a couple of months ago)

[GuillermoBarrancos]

OK yes you're right Zakalwe, so what is the 'best' solid introduction-type Atik mono CCD model; firstlightoptics sell the 320E for around £800? I really don't want to spend over about £800. For planetary work I don't know of any good quality models with the high fps as you said? Any help from anyone appreciated.

What mount and scope do you have that you want to use the camera with?

The 320E can be a nice intro camera, but a secondhand 314L+ will be better.

For planetary a QHY5L-II will give you best bang for buck.

If you are on a small budget, it's best to try planetary imaging first.

DSO imaging is a real money pit. There are no shortcuts.

[Thalestris24]

DSO imaging is a real money pit. There are no shortcuts.

+1 for that - or maybe +2000...

[lensman57]

Hello all,

I am interested in the Atik range for my first CCD camera.  How do you rate their products? Specifically I am interested in the 320E and Titan Mono. Obviously being my first 'outlay' with astronimcal products, I am more inclined towards the Titan Mono with it's lower price. It's high fps mode for planetary, and also it's cooled long exposure mode for deep sky work seems an excellent novice hybrid. I realise a 'jack of all trades' will never compete with 2 specialised ones, but thought this would provide a high quality foundation? Any comments or insights would be appreciated.

Thanks

There  is something reassuring about a camera that just works out of the box and Atiks just do that, they are very good. I have 3 of them, a 16IC mono, 314L+ mono and a 428 EXC. there are however a couple of points that you need to consider,  most of the Atiks are deep sky and not planetary imagers, The Titan can do both but it is a bit slow for fast frame planetary and the sensor is quite small so DSO targets that would fit on the sensor are rather limited, in fact most of the more " affordable " Atiks have small sensors unless you wish to spend upward of £1500.00 so you need to do a bit of research before taking the plunge. As has been suggested DSO imaging  is quite expensive and as time goes by it just gets more expensive so be warned.

Regards,

A.G

[riklaunim]

Hello all,

I am interested in the Atik range for my first CCD camera.  How do you rate their products? Specifically I am interested in the 320E and Titan Mono. Obviously being my first 'outlay' with astronimcal products, I am more inclined towards the Titan Mono with it's lower price. It's high fps mode for planetary, and also it's cooled long exposure mode for deep sky work seems an excellent novice hybrid. I realise a 'jack of all trades' will never compete with 2 specialised ones, but thought this would provide a high quality foundation? Any comments or insights would be appreciated.

Thanks

16-bit low gain Atik Titan is far from effective for planetary imaging. There are nearly no users that use it for planetary imaging. There are multiple users that use it as a high end guide camera. For planetary imaging it's also to expensive, has old low sensitive sensor (for today standards) and is not supported by good planetary capture software like FireCapture SBIG released similar ST-i camera which suffered the same planetary fate (even bigger failure as it's even more expensive and even more limited).

For DS imaging you need a guide camera. The most cost efficient way is to use the planetary camera as a guider for the DS camera. Some planetary cameras are easier to use as guiders than others. Popular now ASI120MM or QHY5L-II have ST4 ports so are very easy to use as guiders. Old and bit expensive for nowadays market DMK21AU618 (and other DMK too) doesn't have ST4 but has a WDM driver and guiding software will see it and will be able to guide. But you will need a direct PC-mount connection (usually via RS232). Other planetary cameras like most point grey cameras may be quite hard to use as guiders (but they will work good as planetary cameras).

So if you want a rock solid setup you need 2 cameras (and probably 2 telescopes - big for planets, small for DSO imaging). The Atik 314E and 320E are the entry level models. They are good if you pick the right telescope for it (small pixels so the telescope should have short focal length and if possible - fast f/ratio). Atik 314L+ and other newer are much more expensive but they are also much more efficient. Something for more demanding photographers.

[choochoo_baloo]

ok thanks all; can someone name a few decent second hand astronomy sites?

[Zakalwe]

You need to think about the telescope that you are going to use and the type of target that you are after. The Atik 314+ is a great camera, but the sensor is small, which means that larger nebula need mosaics.

Here's an example...this is M31 taken with an Equinox and QHY8L

And M31 taken with the same scope and an Atik 428 (which has a sensor a bit bigger than the 314)

Personally, for a budget of about £800, I would be trying to pick up a 2nd hand QHY8L (£600-£700 DSLR sized sensor, very low noise, great build quality, very sensitive) and a 2nd hand ZWO120/QHY5L (£150-ish) for planetary. Those two will rock your world for a long time.

[Astrosurf]

I've just had a look at a site with images taken with a Titan and I was very unimpressed. I know that there's more to imaging than the camera but the quality wasn't too good. Go for the higher range as has been suggested here.

Alexxx

[GuillermoBarrancos]

You still haven't told us what Mount and scope you going to use it with?

[lensman57]

ok thanks all; can someone name a few decent second hand astronomy sites?

Hi Mathew,

As GB has mentioned, you need to tell us what  scope and mount you have or are planning on aquiring as the other point to consider is matching the CCD to the scope but that is another topic all together. There is already an Atik 16 IC mono in the classified section of the forum , this camera has the same sensor as the Titan with cooling but it is not set point, you just turn it on and the Peltier does its best, there is also the UK Astro Buy Sell, last that I looked at there was an Atik 314L+ for about £750.00. You should also consider the QHY8L with a DSLR size sensor and you can buy it new for about £900.00 but it is an OSC with no Mono version.

A.G

[Zakalwe]

Mono with a budget of £800 is very, very tight. Decent LRGB filters are getting near £200 on their own. Then add in a decent filterwheel and adapters and you won't have much change out of £500. A OSC will remove a lot of that cost.

[choochoo_baloo]

The scope and mount (planned at this stage ):

Celestron 8" SCT and Celestron Advanced Vx mount, Orion autoguider oavkage. Will this kit do justice to these two camera that have been recommended: Atik QHY8L and QHY4L?

What secondhand astronomy sites does everyone recommend?

[GuillermoBarrancos]

The scope and mount (planned at this stage ):

Celestron 8" SCT and Celestron Advanced Vx mount, Orion autoguider oavkage. Will this kit do justice to these two camera that have been recommended: Atik QHY8L and QHY4L?

What secondhand astronomy sites does everyone recommend?

The 8inch SCT + Advanced VX is a very Nice package. The SCT is a Nice Scope (had it myself for several years).  Excellent for planetary imaging.

The QHY8L is not Atik tho, it's QHYCCD ( http://qhyccd.com/en/left/page1/qhy8l-8pro/ ) and will be a good match to the long focal length of the SCT due to it's larger pixels.

The QHY5L-II is an excellent planetary camera and very necessary to use as Autoguider in combination With Your CCD camera when doing long exposures for DSO imaging.

With an SCT it's best to use an OAG (Off-Axis Guider) to get as accurate guiding as possible! And a 0,63 Focal Reducer to bring the Focal Ratio Down to F/6,3.

What you need to know tho, is that DSO imaging with the SCT will definitely not be easy, due to it's long focal length! It's not really recommended, as you need to have both Polar Alignment and Auto guiding Perfect under Control! It's very unforgiving and the slightest errors will ruin your exposure!

This can cause a lot of frustration and dissapointment to a beginner! You have to be very patient and incredibly persistent if you want to start out this way!

Usually, when it comes to starting out With DSO imaging, People recommend you start With a short focal length Scope, like the SW 80ED Pro.

Like I said earlier. When it comes to DSO imaging, there are just no shortcuts.

If I were you, I would make up my mind first as to what you want to do and make a Choice first. Either Planetary "or" DSO Imaging.

If you end up chosing to start With Planetary imaging first, then the 8inch SCT + Advanced VX is a Nice combo to start With. The QHY5L-II will be a great and affordable camera, which you can later also use as autoguider for DSO imaging.

If you end up chosing to start With DSO imaging first, then instead of the 8inch SCT, I would go for the SW Evostar 80ED Pro as Scope. Then the QHY8L is still an excellent beginner CCD camera to start out With. Will produce very Nice widefield images with the 80ED. You will still need the QHY5L-II as guidecamera to be able to take long exposures. As otherwise you are Limited to up to 1-2 min exposures depending how perfect your polar alignment is with the Advanced VX Mount.

[swag72]

... an OAG (On-Axis Guider) ...

OAG - Off Axis Guider

[GuillermoBarrancos]

OAG - Off Axis Guider

Corrected!   Is it time for beer yet?

[Thalestris24]

Corrected!    Is it time for beer yet?

I really quite fancy some beer! Pity I'm all alone, no-one to go out with  Sigh.